This pump http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/pspages/goatthroat.php?clickk... has one bad review about o-rings needing replacement and the tube falling off inside the tank, but I don't want to condemn it on one review. Any thoughts about this and similar products and fuel handling at remote strips? I'm thinking of getting a trailer with a fuel tank mounted on the tongue, and using jeep cans.

WT

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Look at motocross fuel cans.  Ever since the feds decided that I was not smart enough to poor gas without spilling, I buy old gas cans at garage sales.  Seems like those anti spill cans make it worse.

Wayne,

My first fuel trailer was built using a salvaged 100 gal aluminum fuel tank from an 18-wheeler mounted on a small utility trailer. The tank obviously required thorough cleaning to get the old diesel gunk out, but was a bargain price! I fitted a Great Plains hand pump, available at Tractor Supply Co. and just about any farm co-op store. The first pump went nearly 25 years before it needed maintenance. Ironically, this fueler is now back to holding diesel again for my farm tractors.

Later, when my avgas requirements increased due to purchasing a C206H Stationair (15 gph in cruise!) , I constructed a second fuel trailer (probably way beyond the scope of what you have in mind). I found a guy who dismantles U-haul trailers on contract (U-haul doesn't want the liability and competition of old U-haul trailers!) and bought an axle with a portion of frame still attached and built a new trailer built from that. It had nearly new, heavy duty trailer tires on it when purchased! I then got a new, sealed, steel 250 gal tank from the farmer's co-op for a very reasonable price, mounted it on the trailer, and put a 12v dc electric pump and filter on it. I now no longer use avgas in the 750, but get 93 UL/no ethanol from a local station ... they love to see me coming since I buy 200+ gal at a time! The trailer is stored indoors in the hangar and I add PRI-G gas treatment to improve the shelf-life, but I run through a load 2-3 times a year.

Hauling substantial amounts of fuel is inherently hazardous - I always make my "gas runs" in excellent weather and traffic conditions and pay close attention to grounding the fueler when pumping the fuel in or out of the tank.

My hangar-mate has one of those wheeled "gas caddys" that holds about 30 gal and has a 12v dc pump. Seems to work well for fueling his RANS. Nice to have the electric pump so you aren't lifting cans to fuel a high-wing!  I don't know the exact brand, but he's had good service from his - I can check the brand name when I go over to the hangar today.

John

N750A

Wayne, you might want to check with your airport manager first. I have the 30 gal wheeled one John talks about, and I'm suppose to have a permit per the fire marshall to keep it in the hanger. You cannot have any fuel trailers parked here also, or gas stored in cans.

Walt Snyder

My airport manager has no problems at all with fuel storage ... of course, my airport manager is ME!  ;>)

(Couldn't resist ... one of the perks of building your own strip!)

John

But I heard he refuses to let pilots use the Porsche airport car....

Walt

Wayne,

The gas caddy my friend uses is made by Todd - I believe Northern Tool sells them. He has a Fill-Rite 15 gpm heavy duty 12vdc pump mounted on top. He's had good service from both, but says the metal pump fitting attached to the plastic gas caddy is prone to leaking, so he has to keep the caddy upright (which is the normal storage position and position to use the wheels, anyway) to avoid leaks.

John

Although I've been delayed doing it for at least a year, I've been meaning to put together a trailer, drum and pump to trailer in my fuel from Sam's Club about 3 miles from the airport hangar where I store my plane. I don't have non-ethanol available but the 93 octane auto fuel is better, and cheaper than 100 low lead.

I was thinking of getting the following 3 items to put together:

1. The pump - Available on Ebay (price varies, but $265 today). I just asked the supplier if it was any problem transferring fuel to a height of 8-10 feet and his reply was : "It will pump that far but might lose some of the gpm to 10 gpm due to to height but also its 50 psi pump."

http://www.ebay.com/itm/161210350209?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&a...

2. A 30-gallon drum for fuel  ($55.95 plus $25.08 shipping for me): Should be easy to mount on trailer since height is only 27 1/2"

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/material-handling/drum-barrel/dru...

3. A small cheap trailer from Harbor Freight (I want the one with 12" wheels on sale for $229.99).

The only thing I had not even thought about was Walt's advice about checking with the Airport Manager. Right now I use 5 and 2 1/2 gallon gas cans to haul fuel from Sam's Club to the hangar, but never even thought about checking to see if its legal. I keep the gas cans in the hangar, but they rarely have any fuel in them. I guess I could take a trailer home after each fill-up if I go that route and I can't keep it at the hangar.

Jim

A guy I know got his Maule mauled by a hangar fire. "Just" a wingtip; it was in the adjacent hangar.

https://www.google.com/search?q=brown+field+hangar+fire&client=...

Some propane tanks blew and threw shrapnel onto a friend of mine's hangar across the way . . .

How do you ground your cans? Are they plastic or metal?

Wayne

Wayne asked:  How do you ground your cans? Are they plastic or metal?

Alyeska Pipeline Service Company  (The Alaska pipeline people) used to actually pay me to boor construction workers for hours on this very topic.  What fun!  

What we're talking about here is a static charge that is caused by the motion of one material past another.  When any two dissimilar materials  (even air and a section of pipeline suspended from a crane) are in relative motion one material will strip electrons off the other.  During this process of electron exchange many electrons become "orphaned".  That is, they are not attached to any molecule and race around in he material looking for someplace to either re-bond or find their way back to earth where they are "home".   Oddly enough, the material that these "orphaned" electrons build up in doesn't need to be a conductor.  They will move around from one molecule to another looking for an open bond.  If you place the plastic gas can on the ground,  concrete, dirt, a steel platform attached by way of framing, whatever, these electrons will flow very quickly to ground and be dissipated. So as a petroleum product flows down a pipeline or hose, it will develop a charge.  The pipeline is grounded and so is the hose at the gas pump, (by way of a spiral wire woven through it's length).  The orphans are drained off as the fuel flows.  When you slide your butt across the seat getting out of the pickup you often become charged.  I always touch the gas pump cabinet before I grab the nozzle.  This gets me and the gas at the same potential.  The pickup has a charge as well just from moving through the air at a high rate of speed.  Fortunately, the orphaned electrons can make their way through even the rubber tires back to earth pretty quickly.  When the nozzle comes in contact with the filler neck there CAN be potential there but not much and the LEL is not right to cause an explosion. Sometimes, back in the olden days anyway, folks would have a length of chain dangling from the vehicle frame to the ground.  The sparks you saw though were mostly about steel being ground off on the pavement.  Not an electrical charge.  

I hope you're all still awake.  In the industry we ALWAYS use a ground wire.  This will bring the airplane and the fuel to the same potential.  I have no idea why we no longer do that with automobiles.  We probably should. 

Not boored, I hope, but I've heard that a plastic can needs to have a copper rod connected to ground in it, whether pumping from it or pouring from it. Is this true?

W

That's a new one on me.  It does give me the willies when pouring from a plastic jug into the wing tank though,  so I first set the jug on the wing while I take the filler cap off. That should even things out.  Fill the plastic jug from the pump only with the jug sitting on the ground. NEVER NEVER while sitting in the bed of the pickup.  

If you examine the logic involved here you'll see what needs to be done.  With a fuel trailer I would definitely have a ground wire between the tank and the pump base.  It's odd when you think of it but we routinely pull up to the pump at the gas station with our cars and pickups and open the cap then stuff the filler hose in the hole.  There is potential there for a spark; especially in dry winter conditions.  Instead, grab the hose, touch the car with your hand while taking the cap off,  then pump.  Don't let the filler neck be the first contact between the car and the gas.  One in a million I know, but like the Lottery, somebody has to win.  

All of this is good advice, but I wonder what the incidence is of sparks and fires during fueling either in autos or planes? Seems like with the gazillion number of times per day that people refuel their cars, we would be reading about cars burning up at the pump most every day! Seems like there have been more battery fires in electric cars! ;>)

John

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