Your own private grass airstrip? - Zenith Aircraft Builders and Flyers2024-03-28T21:56:41Zhttps://zenith.aero/forum/topics/your-own-private-grass-airstrip?commentId=2606393%3AComment%3A186419&x=1&feed=yes&xn_auth=noHope this helps, I don't know…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-28:2606393:Comment:1864192011-12-28T00:05:52.363ZMike Ethridgehttps://zenith.aero/profile/Mike91
<p>Hope this helps, I don't know or have anything to do with this ad but found it in Barnstormer. Trade-a-plane and Barnstormer both normally have 100 plus real estate ads each. Good luck.</p>
<p><font size="4"><a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/classified_614720_Real+Estate+.html" style="color: black; text-decoration: none;"><b>REAL ESTATE</b></a> • <font color="red"><b>OFFERED</b></font> •</font> I have several unique airport properties for sale/lease. Some are for lease. Contact us for…</p>
<p>Hope this helps, I don't know or have anything to do with this ad but found it in Barnstormer. Trade-a-plane and Barnstormer both normally have 100 plus real estate ads each. Good luck.</p>
<p><font size="4"><a style="color: black; text-decoration: none;" href="http://www.barnstormers.com/classified_614720_Real+Estate+.html"><b>REAL ESTATE</b></a> • <font color="red"><b>OFFERED</b></font> •</font> I have several unique airport properties for sale/lease. Some are for lease. Contact us for details • Contact <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/contact_seller.php?to=52689&id=614720&title=Real+Estate+&return=%2FAirport%2BProperty%2C%2520Maryland%2520Classifieds.html">Harry W. Kraemer</a> - <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/contact_seller.php?to=52689&id=614720&title=Real%20Estate%20&return=%2FAirport%2BProperty%2C%2520Maryland%2520Classifieds.html">KRAEMER AVIATION SERVICES</a>, Broker - located Germantown, MD USA • Telephone: 301-520-2109 . • Fax: 240-631-9036 • Posted December 12, 2011 <span style="font-size: 8pt;">• <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/listing.php?mode=usersearch&user=52689">Show all Ads posted by this Advertiser</a> • <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/recommend.php?id=614720&title=Real+Estate+">Recommend This Ad to a Friend</a> • <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/contact_seller.php?to=52689&id=614720&title=Real+Estate+&return=%2FAirport%2BProperty%2C%2520Maryland%2520Classifieds.html">Email Advertiser</a> • <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/ad_manager/watchlist.php?ADD=614720">Save to Watchlist</a> • <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/report_ad.php?id=614720&title=Real+Estate+">Report This Ad</a> • <a href="http://www.barnstormers.com/bac_loan_calc/bac_loanCalc.html" target="_blank">Finance New Lower Rates!</a></span></p> That's an important considera…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-20:2606393:Comment:1840692011-12-20T15:04:34.869ZJim B Belcherhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JimBBelcher
<p>That's an important consideration for many. It may depend on your circumstance, and I suspect there are a wide range of circumstances amongst homebuilders.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I've never carried anything but liability insurance to protect others. But then, I've always owned my airplanes outright, and would have repaired them myself if they were damaged. Assuming, of course, there was anything left to repair.</p>
<p></p>
<p>If I were using my own strip, it really would not matter to me if the…</p>
<p>That's an important consideration for many. It may depend on your circumstance, and I suspect there are a wide range of circumstances amongst homebuilders.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I've never carried anything but liability insurance to protect others. But then, I've always owned my airplanes outright, and would have repaired them myself if they were damaged. Assuming, of course, there was anything left to repair.</p>
<p></p>
<p>If I were using my own strip, it really would not matter to me if the insurance company disallowed the liability. The damage would be to my property.</p> (slightly off topic) There ar…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-20:2606393:Comment:1841522011-12-20T14:58:30.847ZJim B Belcherhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JimBBelcher
<p>(slightly off topic) There are lots of FAA personnel, both good and bad. My personal favorite FAA bureaucrat was the one who took my experience letter for mechanic certification, many years ago. He insisted they were inadequate. Since I'd dotted every "i", and crossed every "t," I asked him to show me what information was lacking.</p>
<p></p>
<p>He whipped out the FARs, fumbled a while, then showed me the experience requirements for a master parachute rigger.</p>
<p></p>
<p>(slightly off topic) There are lots of FAA personnel, both good and bad. My personal favorite FAA bureaucrat was the one who took my experience letter for mechanic certification, many years ago. He insisted they were inadequate. Since I'd dotted every "i", and crossed every "t," I asked him to show me what information was lacking.</p>
<p></p>
<p>He whipped out the FARs, fumbled a while, then showed me the experience requirements for a master parachute rigger.</p>
<p></p> It was the probably the same…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-20:2606393:Comment:1842492011-12-20T13:41:32.661ZJohn Austinhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JohnLAustin
<p>It was the probably the same bureaucrat that took my call at the FAA when I called them about some paperwork questions when I acquired my partially-completed CH750 kit. Before I could finish the first sentence, he interrupted and asked "What are you building?" and I told him "a Zenith CH750." He then cut me off again and said, "You KNOW there's an AD on the wings, right?" "You KNOW you're going to have totally rebuild those wings, right?"</p>
<p>Of course, what I "knew" was that he was…</p>
<p>It was the probably the same bureaucrat that took my call at the FAA when I called them about some paperwork questions when I acquired my partially-completed CH750 kit. Before I could finish the first sentence, he interrupted and asked "What are you building?" and I told him "a Zenith CH750." He then cut me off again and said, "You KNOW there's an AD on the wings, right?" "You KNOW you're going to have totally rebuild those wings, right?"</p>
<p>Of course, what I "knew" was that he was confusing the 750 with the 601. Taking the expeditious course, I simply replied," Oh Yeah, I know all about that and will fix the wings!"</p>
<p>The lesson for today - don't argue with the FAA, just say "Yes sir" and move on! LOL!</p>
<p>Regards,</p>
<p>John</p> I asked them that same questi…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-20:2606393:Comment:1839692011-12-20T13:08:52.529ZChris Aysenhttps://zenith.aero/profile/ChrisAysen
<p>I asked them that same question. Both said the FAA. Maybe as you say it was that "bureaucrat". I have not pursued this personally so my knowledge on the subject is limited. I see them as honest guys and have no reason to doubt them nor did it matter to me at the time. I suppose if I were interested in building a private strip I would educate myself on the subject. However, as I said in my previous post, judging from other post, it seems local regs have a huge influence. So rather FAA…</p>
<p>I asked them that same question. Both said the FAA. Maybe as you say it was that "bureaucrat". I have not pursued this personally so my knowledge on the subject is limited. I see them as honest guys and have no reason to doubt them nor did it matter to me at the time. I suppose if I were interested in building a private strip I would educate myself on the subject. However, as I said in my previous post, judging from other post, it seems local regs have a huge influence. So rather FAA required or not they made understand that this signed petition was a HUGE deal.</p> Very true, but supposedly on…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-20:2606393:Comment:1838262011-12-20T00:20:23.668ZJohn Austinhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JohnLAustin
<p>Very true, but supposedly one reason that some elect to list their strip with the FAA and get it on the sectionals is that then it is "officially" an "airport". That makes it hard for an insurance company to then deny a claim for making an "intentional off-airport landing"! Don't know if that's true, but I would certainly check your insurance policy's coverage for "off-airport" landings!</p>
<p>John</p>
<p>Very true, but supposedly one reason that some elect to list their strip with the FAA and get it on the sectionals is that then it is "officially" an "airport". That makes it hard for an insurance company to then deny a claim for making an "intentional off-airport landing"! Don't know if that's true, but I would certainly check your insurance policy's coverage for "off-airport" landings!</p>
<p>John</p> I'm out in the middle of noth…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-19:2606393:Comment:1837892011-12-19T19:46:58.466ZJim B Belcherhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JimBBelcher
<p>I'm out in the middle of nothing much in far west Texas. I've lost count of the number of strips out here that don't appear on the charts.</p>
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<p>I suspect that if you are far away from everywhere, and land your plane in your own property, don't care if it appears on a chart, etc etc no one is likely to say or do anything.</p>
<p>I'm out in the middle of nothing much in far west Texas. I've lost count of the number of strips out here that don't appear on the charts.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I suspect that if you are far away from everywhere, and land your plane in your own property, don't care if it appears on a chart, etc etc no one is likely to say or do anything.</p> Chris,
That may have been wha…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-19:2606393:Comment:1836072011-12-19T14:12:51.997ZJohn Austinhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JohnLAustin
<p>Chris,</p>
<p>That may have been what the FAA told your friends, but I suspect that was some well-meaning advice from a bureaucrat at the FAA, <em>not</em> a requirement! Could it have been a local zoning requirement and not the FAA? Two useful resources are <a href="http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/form/faa7480-1.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Form 7480</a> - this is the actual form you submit as notice of construction - you also have to attach a US Geological Survey map…</p>
<p>Chris,</p>
<p>That may have been what the FAA told your friends, but I suspect that was some well-meaning advice from a bureaucrat at the FAA, <em>not</em> a requirement! Could it have been a local zoning requirement and not the FAA? Two useful resources are <a href="http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/form/faa7480-1.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Form 7480</a> - this is the actual form you submit as notice of construction - you also have to attach a US Geological Survey map depicting your airstrip's location. There is <em>no</em> requirement for any attached petitions.</p>
<p>Of course, the "ultimate" authority is the <a href="http://www.faa.gov/airports/central/engineering/part157/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">FAA Part 157 Regulation</a>. They have an excellent summary:</p>
<h3 id="purpose"><em>Purpose of Filing a Notice</em></h3>
<p><em>Federal Regulation 14 CFR Part 157 establishes standards and notification requirements for anyone proposing to construct, alter, or deactivate a civil or joint-use (civil/military) airport. This regulation also addresses proposal to alter the status or use of such an airport.</em></p>
<p><em>This notification serves as the basis for evaluating the effects of the proposed action on the safe and efficient use of airspace by aircraft and the safety of persons and property on the ground. These effects include but are not limited to:</em></p>
<ul id="rrul25">
<li><em>Evaluating the effects the proposed action would have on existing or proposed traffic patterns of neighboring airports,</em></li>
<li><em>The effect the proposed action would have on the existing airspace structure and projected programs of the FAA</em></li>
<li id="rrli112"><em>The effects that existing or proposed objects (on file with the FAA) within the affected area would have on the airport proposal</em></li>
</ul>
<p><em>Notification allows the FAA to identify potential aeronautical hazards in advance, thus preventing or minimizing the adverse impacts to the safe and efficient use of navigable airspace.</em></p>
<p>The FAA may be guilty of regulatory over-kill, but thankfully, they don't require the neighbor's input! That being said, I think one would be ill-advised to invest a lot in an airport without giving nearby neighbors a heads-up - I have a friend who was shut-down by lawsuit threats, but he was trying to develop an airpark, and usually that involves subdivision and zoning regulations, too. You are absolutely correct, the local regs will trump everything after the FAA.</p>
<p>Regards,</p>
<p>John</p> Here I have a couple of frien…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-19:2606393:Comment:1835412011-12-19T13:32:56.232ZChris Aysenhttps://zenith.aero/profile/ChrisAysen
<p>Here I have a couple of friends with airstrips. Both were told by the FAA to get surrounding neighbors to sign a petition stating their approval. Judging from the different post this is far from a "black & white" issue. But there are thousands of private strips. It seems local regs play the biggest part.</p>
<p>Here I have a couple of friends with airstrips. Both were told by the FAA to get surrounding neighbors to sign a petition stating their approval. Judging from the different post this is far from a "black & white" issue. But there are thousands of private strips. It seems local regs play the biggest part.</p> I built TN66 about 20 years a…tag:zenith.aero,2011-12-17:2606393:Comment:1830382011-12-17T13:46:04.284ZJohn Austinhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JohnLAustin
<p>I built TN66 about 20 years ago ... 2100 x 100. I operated a 210 hp Isham conversion 172XP out of there for several years, and now a 206/Stationair. Very comfortable length for both these planes. I guess when I finish the 750, 2100' will make it feel like I have "unlimited runway length" HA!</p>
<p>The FAA does not pass any "approval" on your airstrip. The regulations state that they merely determine that your airstrip "is not a hazard to the US air transportation system." HOWEVER, if your…</p>
<p>I built TN66 about 20 years ago ... 2100 x 100. I operated a 210 hp Isham conversion 172XP out of there for several years, and now a 206/Stationair. Very comfortable length for both these planes. I guess when I finish the 750, 2100' will make it feel like I have "unlimited runway length" HA!</p>
<p>The FAA does not pass any "approval" on your airstrip. The regulations state that they merely determine that your airstrip "is not a hazard to the US air transportation system." HOWEVER, if your strip IS a "hazard", then they can most certainly shut you down. State aviation departments vary, but in Tennessee, they had zero interest - just told me to notify the FAA.</p>
<p>I was fortunate to have 800 acres in which to locate my strip, so I could pretty much keep it away from the few neighbors I have, so no problems there. There were no county zoning issues, either. (Tennesse is a great place to live! LOL!) From talking to others, I would suggest if there are nearby neighbors, be proactive and tell them your intentions - most people envision a municipal airport when you say you're building an "airstrip" and have visions of dozens of planes constantly buzzing around. In reality, at most private airstrips, there aren't that many operations occuring and they are usually at decent hours and not disturbing the neighbor's sleep!</p>
<p>I allowed about a year to get mature turf on my strip. A great tip from a friend who had built a strip - the average grading contractor will try to build something perfectly flat and level. That will require the center to be crowned and require drainage ditches on the sides. DON'T do that unless you're on perfectly flat ground! If there is any slope side-to-side or up and down the strip, just leave a few degrees of the slope. That way, the strip will drain and it'll save thousands of $$ of dirt moving. You'll never notice a few degrees of slope in either direction when landing or taking off.</p>
<p>I did put it on the Sectional, and even better, after operating out of it a while, Atlanta Center asked me if they could put it on their radar map! I guess this was because I'm just 4 nm from the HCH VOR and they wanted to see exactly where I was going to when I came in from the west. The best part was I could then file IFR direct to my strip (had to be able to do a visual to land, of course).</p>
<p>Regards,</p>
<p>John</p>
<p> </p>