Fuel sistem . 601 HD Injection with header tank problem - Zenith Aircraft Builders and Flyers2024-03-29T13:54:50Zhttps://zenith.aero/forum/topics/fuel-sistem-601-hd-injection-with-header-tank-problem?commentId=2606393%3AComment%3A590610&feed=yes&xn_auth=noThis fuel system is similar t…tag:zenith.aero,2017-12-22:2606393:Comment:6043122017-12-22T17:15:40.323ZPatrick Hoythttps://zenith.aero/profile/PatrickHoyt
<p>This fuel system is similar to what I have installed in my 601. Google "Viking mini header tank" for details.</p>
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<p>I've rebuilt much of my aircraft after losing an engine in flight, but have not re-flown it yet. In my case, my small header tank is mounted on the floor on the passenger side, in front of the main spar. </p>
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<p>Motivation for me was discomfort regarding switching back and forth between left & right tanks as the fuel levels decreased while flying. The…</p>
<p>This fuel system is similar to what I have installed in my 601. Google "Viking mini header tank" for details.</p>
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<p>I've rebuilt much of my aircraft after losing an engine in flight, but have not re-flown it yet. In my case, my small header tank is mounted on the floor on the passenger side, in front of the main spar. </p>
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<p>Motivation for me was discomfort regarding switching back and forth between left & right tanks as the fuel levels decreased while flying. The defacto solution was never flying with less than roughly half tankfuls, but that is a lot of extra weight to carry all the time. The amount of time needed to restart my previous engine following "running a tank dry" (and more importantly - running the fuel line from the selector valve to the carburetor dry) was longer than I believe that I could have stayed in the air unless I was quite high.</p>
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<p>Also, I was unable to make check valves work in this scenario. They were located in the same place as yours are in your diagram. It is possible that my check valves required more "fuel head" pressure than do yours.</p>
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<p>Patrick Hoyt</p>
<p>N63PZ</p>
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<p></p> THANKS FOR ALL RESPONSES: Is…tag:zenith.aero,2017-12-22:2606393:Comment:6042202017-12-22T15:43:58.149Zrubens rando sanchezhttps://zenith.aero/profile/rubensrandosanchez
<p>THANKS FOR ALL RESPONSES: Is was very helpful</p>
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<p>I have to sai that i FOUND THE SOLUTION:</p>
<p>The problem was in the vent tubes, wich had both siphoning of fuel , because i was a low poin in both holders.</p>
<p>Now i have the both in correct place, and no siphoning was ocurrs.</p>
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<p>THANKS FOR ALL RESPONSES: Is was very helpful</p>
<p></p>
<p>I have to sai that i FOUND THE SOLUTION:</p>
<p>The problem was in the vent tubes, wich had both siphoning of fuel , because i was a low poin in both holders.</p>
<p>Now i have the both in correct place, and no siphoning was ocurrs.</p>
<p></p>
<p></p> thanks for the response!
tag:zenith.aero,2017-11-03:2606393:Comment:5960472017-11-03T18:55:02.539Zrubens rando sanchezhttps://zenith.aero/profile/rubensrandosanchez
<p>thanks for the response!</p>
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<p>thanks for the response!</p>
<p></p> Hi Rubens, somewhere in the c…tag:zenith.aero,2017-10-06:2606393:Comment:5910772017-10-06T18:17:38.561ZHenri Luyckxhttps://zenith.aero/profile/HenriLuyckx
<p>Hi Rubens, somewhere in the comments someone mentioned the fuel getting to warm being pumped around from an to the header tank. Your header tank is rather small. I know that it is recommended to have a header tank (when the return fuel is going back to that tank) of minimum 5 liters just to overcome the problem of fuel (and also the fuel pump) getting too hot. By the way I am building (almost finished) a CH701 with a R1100 engine.</p>
<p>Hi Rubens, somewhere in the comments someone mentioned the fuel getting to warm being pumped around from an to the header tank. Your header tank is rather small. I know that it is recommended to have a header tank (when the return fuel is going back to that tank) of minimum 5 liters just to overcome the problem of fuel (and also the fuel pump) getting too hot. By the way I am building (almost finished) a CH701 with a R1100 engine.</p> I don't know why fuel would f…tag:zenith.aero,2017-10-04:2606393:Comment:5907062017-10-04T15:51:34.903ZJoe Hopwoodhttps://zenith.aero/profile/JoeHopwood
<p>I don't know why fuel would flow any better from header tank than wing tank. Every additional item added to any system beyond what is necessary increases probability of failure. Your need is wing tanks, duplex fuel valve and supply and return lines. </p>
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<p>Some low wing planes have a small (5 gal) header tank so fuel can gravity flow to engine and use fuel pumps to fill header. But with your header lower than the wing tanks you do not get any benefit that I can see.</p>
<p>I don't know why fuel would flow any better from header tank than wing tank. Every additional item added to any system beyond what is necessary increases probability of failure. Your need is wing tanks, duplex fuel valve and supply and return lines. </p>
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<p>Some low wing planes have a small (5 gal) header tank so fuel can gravity flow to engine and use fuel pumps to fill header. But with your header lower than the wing tanks you do not get any benefit that I can see.</p> imagine this situation. the d…tag:zenith.aero,2017-10-04:2606393:Comment:5907582017-10-04T09:15:41.354Zrubens rando sanchezhttps://zenith.aero/profile/rubensrandosanchez
<p>imagine this situation. the diagram above is the suposing sistem directly to wing tank. </p>
<p>but , i added in diagram , a wall and a pipe for transfer fuel between chambers , adding the dampening effect. </p>
<p>i want to show this , because the actual system i have(ilustrated below) is the analogue system , With ONE clear difference. the ventilation an equalisation in air pressures in the abobe diagram is instantaneus, and the fuel flow by the diference on level only(communicating…</p>
<p>imagine this situation. the diagram above is the suposing sistem directly to wing tank. </p>
<p>but , i added in diagram , a wall and a pipe for transfer fuel between chambers , adding the dampening effect. </p>
<p>i want to show this , because the actual system i have(ilustrated below) is the analogue system , With ONE clear difference. the ventilation an equalisation in air pressures in the abobe diagram is instantaneus, and the fuel flow by the diference on level only(communicating vessels principle) </p>
<p>my second system , have the disadvantage of vent lines too small in my opinion, and in practice , are not straight tubes , all ve t tubes have little ondulations , witch contributes to air locking.</p>
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<p>sais this , do you agree with me , that if i put larger vent tubes , and make straight , ensuring the all time all condition venting , will solucionate the problem? </p>
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<p>next i will post videos in flight of this problem , and try to record the vent tubes (are transparent ptpfe teflon made) for see the air locking , and relation with alarm sound!</p> tag:zenith.aero,2017-10-04:2606393:Comment:5906132017-10-04T09:04:34.049Zrubens rando sanchezhttps://zenith.aero/profile/rubensrandosanchez
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/2171030963?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/2171030963?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" width="721" class="align-full"/></a></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/2171030963?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/2171030963?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" width="721" class="align-full"/></a></p> maybe , this would be the les…tag:zenith.aero,2017-10-04:2606393:Comment:5906102017-10-04T08:14:51.465Zrubens rando sanchezhttps://zenith.aero/profile/rubensrandosanchez
<p>maybe , this would be the less drastic mod , because i havent to touch anythig in fuel routing. only add two facet pumps , in parallel with the check valves, and activate them ? the fuel will go trought the vent lines to the tanks</p>
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<p>maybe , this would be the less drastic mod , because i havent to touch anythig in fuel routing. only add two facet pumps , in parallel with the check valves, and activate them ? the fuel will go trought the vent lines to the tanks</p>
<p></p> Putting Facet fuel pumps to r…tag:zenith.aero,2017-10-04:2606393:Comment:5906092017-10-04T08:07:52.639Zrubens rando sanchezhttps://zenith.aero/profile/rubensrandosanchez
<p><span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Putting Facet fuel pumps to refill the header tank will create a new series of problems. How will you control them? If you leave them both on they will be pumping more fuel than the engine pumps needs and you will end up filling the header header tank - and pumping fuel back through the vent lines to the wing tanks.</span> </span></p>
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<p><span>thanks for help. answerng this parraph , if facet fuel pumps overfill the header tank, it…</span></p>
<p><span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Putting Facet fuel pumps to refill the header tank will create a new series of problems. How will you control them? If you leave them both on they will be pumping more fuel than the engine pumps needs and you will end up filling the header header tank - and pumping fuel back through the vent lines to the wing tanks.</span> </span></p>
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<p><span>thanks for help. answerng this parraph , if facet fuel pumps overfill the header tank, it returns over the vent lines , in the least resistance way, to the main tanks, no mather this , because the wing tanks have their own vent lines. see ilustrations.</span></p>
<p></p> thanks both joes!
the small…tag:zenith.aero,2017-10-04:2606393:Comment:5905152017-10-04T07:54:08.013Zrubens rando sanchezhttps://zenith.aero/profile/rubensrandosanchez
<p>thanks both joes!</p>
<p>the small header tank is designed for ensure continous flow in every attitude.</p>
<p>think that, in the past 70 hours of flight , including test flights , all were seem to be ok. </p>
<p>The interesting thing is in the last long flights , where this alarm happened. Luckly i installed that alarm. </p>
<p>Maybe , if not , there was the posibility of big surprise!</p>
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<p>thanks both joes!</p>
<p>the small header tank is designed for ensure continous flow in every attitude.</p>
<p>think that, in the past 70 hours of flight , including test flights , all were seem to be ok. </p>
<p>The interesting thing is in the last long flights , where this alarm happened. Luckly i installed that alarm. </p>
<p>Maybe , if not , there was the posibility of big surprise!</p>
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